They call it Paradise, I call it Home ©

The Terrorists Of Al-Qaeshmir

In India, Kashmir, News, People, Politics, Srinagar on 14 June, 2007 at 12:41 am

The Indian state and blindia (the blind Indian media) have been working tirelessly to brand Kashmiris as Terrorists and Fundamentalists and the Kashmiri Freedom Struggle as Terrorism. These endless campaigns have been successful within India, where people at large see the Kashmiris as terrorists and the human rights abuses the Kashmiris have to suffer at the hands of the Indian Army as the outcome of supporting the terrorists being pushed from across the border, conveniently coined as the Cross Border Terrorism (CBT).

Bollywood has lent a further helping hand by portraying Kashmiris as terrorists whenever and wherever they can. The most recent attempt was seen in Sarhad, starring Sanjay Dutt, in which the terrorist drives a vehicle with a Kashmir number plate. Both the Indian and the Pakistani armies are trying to neutralize the terrorist, the reference possibly being that Kashmiris are a bother for both nations.

Even though the smear-campaigns have worked in India, they have no takers in the west. The western media still sees Kashmir as a disputed territory. BBC, Encarta, CNN, Encyclopedia Britannica, National Geographic et al still refer to Kashmir as Indian or Pakistani controlled Kashmir as the case maybe. The issues of National Geographic on sale in India usually have an ugly rubber stamped on the maps of this region:the boundaries shown are not correct. Stamp or no stamp, it is not going to change how west sees Kashmir. Sending back or destroying copies of encyclopedia Britannica will effect no change in the policy of the west, that of Kashmir being a disputed territory pending final settlement.

The OC  The people in the west  are still struggling to understand the difference between Kashmir and Cashmere Shawls. The following conversation from Orange County (Season2, Episode 53) pretty much sums up the confusions still surrounding the word Kashmir.

Abigail Stevens: I was saying that what’s happening in Kashmir just shows us–

Summer: I know! Pashminas this season were so cute. I don’t go anywhere without my Cashmere purse!

The conversation continues with Abigail telling Summer that they were discussing the conflict in Kashmir and whether Kashmir should be independent or remain with India and then ask Summer her opinion!

 

Western Experts On Kashmir

 

 

Professor William Baker Kashmiris are not seen as terrorists by the west, not even extremists. These are the thoughts of an expert, Professor William Baker, on Kashmiris and their struggle:

On Kashmiris not being radicals:

Professor William Baker, who heads the California-based organization, Christians and Muslims for Peace, and is the author of Kashmir: Happy Valley, Valley of Death, says that people who live in the valley of Kashmir are not Islamic radicals out to establish a separate Islamic state.

“The people of Kashmir – those in the valley of Kashmir – are not radical Islamists wanting an Islamic state; they do not.”

On what the Kashmiris want:

“These people are extremely educated and open and free-minded and I’ve never met any Kashmiris in the valley who did not say that they don’t want to be owned by either country (India or Pakistan).”

 On the Indian/Pakistani occupation:

 “If one is an enemy if you oppose injustice, if one is an enemy is you oppose occupation, then okay, I am an enemy of anybody who occupies another country illegally or tortures or anything else, including my own country.”

 

The real threat, as the world perceives it, is from the Hindu extremists in India and not the Kashmiris Muslims.

 

chomsky

  Noam Chomsky

On the dangers of Hindu extremism

There are real dangers. The Hindu nationalist danger is certainly serious.


On the Indian Diaspora’s being more extreme 

…what I’ve seen of the Indian Diaspora … is that it tends to be more extreme, more pro-BJP [Bharatiya Janata Party] than the native population would. At least that’s what I’ve seen.

The threat does come from Hindu extremist elements,the recent ban on Orkut is an example of the low level of tolerance for free speech. This news though has not been as widely covered by the blindia as was the ban by some militant groups in Kashmir last year on Music channels during the holy month of Ramadhan, yet another example of the working of blindia.

 

 The Indian Army who are mostly seen as saviors by the Indian population are not perceived as such by the western experts.

 

 K Alan feels:

There was something oppressive about the security presence in Srinagar and even out in the countryside. You really couldn’t get away from it. It’s like you were reminded, everywhere you looked, that there was a security problem. I could see how the people there might even feel like there was an occupying army because I do know some people feel that way.

History is witness to how India and its slaves in Kashmir ridicule Kashmir and Kashmiris- when innocent Kashmiris are killed in fake encounters, the government promises enquiries or rewards the killers; when innocent girls are exploited by the highest seats of government, the government shifts the case to a court outside Kashmir and reinstates the officers involved in the scandal; when people ask for roads they are shown the palaces the rulers will occupy and when people protest against the army – the Chief Minister promises the army utmost support. Despite all this, the international media and experts still do not buy India’s argument of Kashmiris being Terrorists and Kashmir a hot-bed of Islamic Terrorism. Frustrated, the Government has recently tried something more unique, more digital but even that will fall flat on their faces. The government of India is attempting to establish Al-Qaeda presence in Kashmir, which in their opinion should help them garner the much required American support. In the coming months we might see reports of Osama Bin Laden hiding in Kashmir and then we will see American Apache helicopters burning down the forests of Kashmir. The Chief Minister of Kashmir as well as the United Jihad Council has ruled out the presence of Al-Qaeda in Kashmir. UJC spokesman has said that Kashmiris know how to fight the war of freedom and there was no place for Al Qaeda whatsoever on Kashmiris’ soil.  However one needs to remain cautious as the government of India will go as far as it has to to cry out loud to the world that Kashmiris are terrorists and Kashmir a terrorism hot spot, but none of that will succeed, not today, not tomorrow.

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  1. Hghly toxic journalism.

  2. “Blindia”, a very smart and apt way to put Indian media in one word!

    I appeal to all you non-kashmiri readers of this blog……please do not try to refute the argument that has been presented here just because it does not fit your line of thinking or does not conform to what you have been believing till date.

    Please understand our perspective, and understand we are not terrorists, we are not radical “Islamists”. We simply want our Paradise back, which belongs to us.

    I request you to please spread our message to others and put the link of this blog on your own (if you have one) and tell the fellow Indian masses what is the real story.

  3. […] Kashmir on the perception of Kashmiris in India and in Indian media as terrorists. Share This […]

  4. Hmmm…it seems that you are not well read…the media in India is quite unbiased and they worry about the Hindu extremists as much as Muslim extrimists…It seems you have no idea about the problems faced by PoK people….when you come to know about their problems, you will realise that Indian Kashmir is a very good place to live in with much more freedom than the people on the other side of border….
    A totally misinformed article written by you.

  5. Hmmm…it seems that you are not well read…the media in India is quite unbiased

    Not well read about what? I do not need to read to know the truth about your so-called unbiased Indian media. Have lived long enough in Kashmir to know the reality of the Blind India Media (or Blindia as I call it)

    and they worry about the Hindu extremists as much as Muslim extremists…

    Who are the Muslim extremists? Are you referring to us Kashmir? Did you even read this post?

    It seems you have no idea about the problems faced by PoK people….

    Why are you comparing Apples and Oranges. Isn’t a dictatorship in place in Pakistan and a democracy in India? Or maybe even you believe it is a Daemon-racy and that’s why the comparison.

  6. People in Indian-occupied Kashmir have more freedom than other side of Kashmir? What is the ratio of the army and the anti-terrorist units in Kashmir? British India was a good place to live in for some Indians but it did not prevent them from wanting to rule themselves.

    The Kashmiris’ aspiration to govern themselves as an independent nation, irrespective of religious and ethnic bias, should not be denigrated.

  7. Rifat Nazeer wrote:

    The Kashmiris’ aspiration to govern themselves as an independent nation, irrespective of religious and ethnic bias, should not be denigrated.

    I fully agree with the above. People’s aspirations must come supreme in any civilized society. However it will be wrong to pretend that at its root Kashmir issue is anything else but a religious one.

    I hate to say this but muslim community the world over remains in a state of perpetual outrage. If not the excess of security forces, there will be some other excuse that will justify breaking apart from ‘infidels’.

    The real issue is that the ideology of “kill the infidels, wherever ye find them” and the constant vilification of unbelievers in Islam, precludes any peaceful co-existence with followers of other religions. Even rich western democracies such as UK and France have not been able to persuade their Muslim population otherwise. India is hardly in a position to be an exception.

  8. Abhilash, I am sorry to say that you are yet another of those who suffer from ‘Islamophobia’ and like most phobias – this is based on your misunderstanding of Islam and its teachings.

    By saying that ‘we’ are just looking for ‘excuse’ to break apart from the ‘infidels’, you are not only justifying what is inhuman, you are actually showing how the ‘misinformation propaganda’ of India has succeeded.

    I could write on and on, but instead, I’d rather give you something to ponder upon:

    Kashmiris have lived in peace with each other. Just coz people followed different faith never was an issue with us. If it was, the Sikhs who are a minority in Kashmir, would have been easy targets. How come you never heard of any ‘excesses’ done by ‘terrorist minded kashmiris’ against the Sikhs.

    We demand justice. And when people ask for justice, they are generally are rebuffed and the ones in power torture them. This is expected.

    What is not expected and sad indeed is that people who see this — start justifying it…

    But then.. this is India.. what else can be expected?

  9. Abhilash, I absolutely agree with you. If it were not about religion, why would the anti-India sentiment be limited to only Muslims of Kashmir province. I am not saying they are wrong (or right) to demand separation, what I am saying is that disconnecting the demand from religion is wrong and misleading. Why don’t we (Hindus) and Sikhs, or people of other regions of the state feel subjugated by India — that too when it has been the Muslims of Kashmir who ruled after 1947? Those rulers may have been “puppets” of Delhi, but they were not representatives of the minorities any more than that.

    Sakooter has conveniently forgotten about Chittisinghpora massacre and does not want to talk about massacres of other minorities. I don’t want to talk about that either, because that causes another burst of anti-India rhetoric on this blog.

    Rifat Bhai, please do not compare British rule with Indian government. Britishers were definitely foreigners. Calling Indians foreigners is a matter of your convenience.

  10. Chittisinghpora?
    That was one incident that put whole of Kashmir in shock. And to my understanding of how India works in Kashmir (just in case u question this, let me remind you I LIVE HERE!), this was another of those government-masterminded events… like so many others…

    The “Battas” that were targetted were not targeted initially coz they were “hindus” but because they held high government positions. Even the Muslims who were at such positions which could have harmed the struggle were forced out. It was not Hindu/Muslim issue, it was issue of moving on with the struggle against Indian government. You can see the parallels in the rise of India against the British rule… weren’t the Indians who held high positions with the British government targeted?

    And talking of religion – I wish it was completely an Islamic struggle — for if it was, not a single bit of injustice would have happened from the side of the men who have led the armed struggle against India. There is an element of religious affiliation, and I don’t see why that is an issue? People can demand separation on basis of ideology, identity, history — we Kashmiris have all the reasons… only if you cared to read.

    You, like most of India, will continue to believe the lies perpetrated by ‘Blindia’ simply because that is the convenient way out.

    Rest assured ‘ignorance’ is bliss. You can continue to believe that Kashmiris consider themselves Indians. That would be believing a lie. But then, sometimes lies are easier to accept than truth.

    they say,
    Truth is bitter.

    I wonder what happened to:
    “Satya maev jaytay”

  11. Raman Koul:
    From the source you had given:

    Nanak Singh Bedi was the only survivor and eyewitness of the Chittisinghpora massacre. He had been seriously injured. “I can only tell you those masked killers were human beings. I cannot say whether they were Armymen or militants or who,” he said. He too strongly favours an independent inquiry. “It was a big conspiracy and everything had been planned. It needs a thorough investigation to expose it.” He said the militants had not done any harm to them during the past 10 years.

    Now, this is a Sikh talking, not me or Sakooter. Try as hard as you can but your Auschwitz in Kashmir does not have a lot of takers beyond the Indian borders, and if it weren’t for blindia, even people in India wouldn’t give your claim of Islamic zealots ruining Kashmir another thought.

    Sakooter:

    Truth indeed shall prevail!

  12. Sakooter said:

    Abhilash, I am sorry to say that you are yet another of those who suffer from ‘Islamophobia’ and like most phobias – this is based on your misunderstanding of Islam and its teachings.

    Sakooter, I will be greatly relieved if my concerns are proved to be ungrounded ‘phobia’. Both my country of birth (India) and country of adoption (US) are multi-religious societies and I sincerely pray that my fear is proved wrong.

    Unfortunately, when I look at the world map, I am not so optimistic. I do not see a single country on this planet earth where muslims are living in peaceful co-existence with people of other religion. It is at this point that I start loosing hope. If I were a muslim, I would be equally concerned about this peculiar phenomenon about my religion that you are trying to brush aside.

  13. Ah! A very rough look at FACTS should do you good:

    Please try to see where are Muslims a cause of the problem in these major events that shook the world:

    – World War I – 18 million people dead – Muslims??
    – Word War II – 32 million people dead – Muslims??
    – Trans Atlantic Slave trade – (no other than you great country of adoption took part in) – Muslims??
    – Genocide of inigenous Americans & Australians – Muslims??
    – Northern Ireland – bombings and killings b/w protestants and catholics… Muslims??
    – Mafia criminal organisations in Italy and America… Muslims??
    – Columbian drug wars .. Muslims??
    – Apartheid .. Muslims??
    – Church involvement in massacre of Hutu & Tutsi populations in Rwanda… Muslims??
    – Ethnic cleansing, rape and massacre of Bosnian Muslims by Serbs..Muslims??

    and talking of individuals that shook the world.. Stalin, Hitler, Charles Taylor .. and your dear Bush .. none of them are Muslims.

    I do not condone acts of violence done by Muslims. There are some black sheep amongst us too. But judging Islam and all the adherents of the the religion based on a few is very illogical.

    Muslims have lived in peace. But we believe in justice. If you think we should quietly bear with all the injustice that is thrown upon them, you are very wrong.

    Does the ideology you believe in teach you to shut up and bear with all the injustice that is thrown on you?

  14. Sakooter:

    This discussion is diluting the Kashmir issue. However I will make another attempt to clarify my position.

    All the examples that you have given above are irrelevant. None of your examples here disprove my argument that muslims cannot live peacefully with followers of other religions. Please notice that in all these examples parties of conflict are against each other only in some specific geographical area. While in case of muslims, they are ALWAYS up against followers of other religions. Sorry to be harsh here, but I do not know how else to explain this.

    It is because of this reason that I suspect that at its root Kashmir is not a national struggle but a religious conflict.

    And no. My ideology does not teach me to shut up when faced with injustice, however if my ideology always leads others to do ‘injustice’ against me, then I would probably take a hard look on my ideology itself.

  15. K said:

    Kashmiris are not seen as terrorists by the west, not even extremists.

    Talking of world media, you may find this interesting:
    Slate

  16. @Sakooter

    Chittisinghpora?That was one incident that put whole of Kashmir in shock. And to my understanding of how India works in Kashmir (just in case u question this, let me remind you I LIVE HERE!), this was another of those government-masterminded events… like so many others…

    It is as easy for you people to blame Indian government for everything, as it is for the Indians to blame the terrorists. Your LIVING THERE doesn’t prove anything nor does it give you access to what goes on in terrorist cells or in the government. As a separatist sympathiser, itis more convenient for you to blame the Indians.
    ~K~, Nanak Singh Bedi’s statement does not prove anything. All he says is that the killers were masked, which is nothing unusual. But, saying that Indian government did it is like saying US attacked the WTC and Pentagon itself. That is a nice way to diverting the blame.

    And talking of religion – I wish it was completely an Islamic struggle — for if it was, not a single bit of injustice would have happened from the side of the men who have led the armed struggle against India.

    Again, it is easy for you to say that as a Muslim, but for those who have seen or borne the brunt of militant Islam througout the world, it’s not so easy.

    There is an element of religious affiliation, and I don’t see why that is an issue? People can demand separation on basis of ideology, identity, history — we Kashmiris have all the reasons… only if you cared to read.

    Exactly, that is what I said. Only, let us stop saying, “it is not about religion”. However, in the region, separatism on the basis of religion has led to a lot of bloodshed, and it should not be repeated again and again. It has resulted in failed states, re-divisions, and other problems — proving earlier theories about division being the solution wrong. I hope you don’t want to go that failed route. But if you do, I wish you success. But, the path (and beyond) is riddled with bullets, so don’t complain. At the same time, I don’t see what part of your (or my) ideology, identity, or history sets us apart from India, which is a diverse country and a lot of that diversity is shared with Kashmir. Then again, it is not easy for a whole generation of Kashmiris to give up on this movement, when they have grown on an anti-India sentiment. If you think in case of Kashmir’s secession future generations are going to thank you, don’t be so sure.

    You, like most of India, will continue to believe the lies perpetrated by ‘Blindia’ simply because that is the convenient way out.

    On the other hand, you can mislead other Indian readers of these blogs about so called “blindia”, but not those who are Kashmiris themselves.

    Rest assured ‘ignorance’ is bliss. You can continue to believe that Kashmiris consider themselves Indians. That would be believing a lie. But then, sometimes lies are easier to accept than truth.

    بہ چھُس کٲشُر مگر گوڈ چھُس بہ ہندوستٲنی۔
    That is Kashmiri for: I am a Kashmiri and I consider myself an Indian first. So do all non-Muslim Kashmiris – though those living in Kashmir may not openly say so. So do all residents of Jammu and other regions of J&K, in general. That amounts to millions of people. Yes, a majority of Kashmiri Muslims may not consider themselves Indians, and I know this baffles many Indians. But counting their opinion alone will need many geographic divisions, many wheels of time turned back, many people returned, and many graves unearthed.

    I wonder what happened to: “Satya maev jaytay”

    It has gone to the dogs, just like so many slogans professing allegiance to peace and justice. Moreover it is all relative. Just like your list, another list can be made of stories starting from Bali to Beslan to London to Madrid to New York, with new headlines being added everyday, today, and all of them have a common denominator. And, no, killing innocent people in trains, buses, offices and night-clubs has nothing to do with justice and peace.

  17. Let’s get some facts right here.
    – 1. None of us (me or ~K~) ever condoned acts of violence that are done against innocent people. It is only the likes of you who justify the killings – because you view us – the Muslims – as deservant of being treated like that.

    -2. You consider us – the Muslims – deserving such treatment because you ‘believe’ that Muslims are terrorists. I’d say double standards…
    Hitler was a Christian and he tortured the Jews… Does that make all Christians bad? No.
    Transatlantic slave trade was done by Christians who thought of the Africans as barbaric, due to their religious,cultural affiliations, colour etc… Doe that put the blame on Christianity? No.
    When the Indians treated their own brethren – the Shudras – as untouchables, do we sit and put the blame on Hinduism? No.

    Then why have double standards when Muslims are concerned?

    -3. A look at the world map — yes, I see lot of Muslims areas in conflict.
    But if you blame Palestinians of being hostile ‘coz they don’t want to give away what is rightfully theirs, I seriously don’t know what ideology you believe in.
    If you blame the Bosnians of hostility ‘coz the Serbs came and tortured them, I can’t help but question your value system.
    If you wanted the Chechnyans to sit and watch while Yeltsin and his troops came and murdered them in cold blood, you got to rethink your principles.

    If you don’t see them as Muslims, but as people who have been suffering injustice and you would take their side.
    But the moment you know they are Muslims, you put the blame on them. Doesn’t this speak of double standards and a serious case of Islamophobia?

    4.- Where Kashmir is the case, lets talk opinion of the majority. Let’s speak of DEMOCRACY… the majority doesn’t consider themselves Indians.
    Well… then its about time you accept the facts and stop cribbing about Kashmiri-Muslims all the time.
    I do NOT consider myself an Indian.

    If you are an Indian, live in India, swear by India.. but Oh!.. you left your great country for another…
    and maybe in a short span of time, we could opt for America and say we would want to be part of America…
    Hum kya chahtay.. America… cool!

    after all America is a country rich in culture… and it would be good for our economy, for our defence… bla bla bla… Why not?

    5. I could write more… but … never mind!

  18. Sakooter said:

    1. None of us (me or ~K~) ever condoned acts of violence that are done against innocent people. It is only the likes of you who justify the killings – because you view us – the Muslims – as deservant of being treated like that.

    You are in your own world refusing to read what I write.
    When did I justify innocent killings? I wrote in any civilized society people’s aspirations must come supreme. I wrote that killing of innocent people is inexcusable esp. where it is done by law enforcing agencies. Nowhere did I write that Muslims deserve such treatment. It is you who are filling the gaps through your fertile imagination.
    All I have argued is that Kashmir is not a national struggle but a religious conflict to establish a darul-islam in Kashmir. How does amount to condoning violence?

    You consider us – the Muslims – deserving such treatment because you ‘believe’ that Muslims are terrorists. I’d say double standards…Hitler was a Christian and he tortured the Jews… Does that make all Christians bad? No.
    Transatlantic slave trade was done by Christians who thought of the Africans as barbaric, due to their religious,cultural affiliations, colour etc… Does that put the blame on Christianity? No.

    Yes, Christians butchered Jews in Germany, but elsewhere they are perfectly capable of living in harmony with Jews.
    Yes, Christians engaged in slave trade, but come to US or UK and you will find that they are living in perfect peace with ‘barbaric’ Africans?
    Now, you show me one place where Muslims are living in peace with non-Muslims?
    And still you want to deny that it is about religion?

    Doesn’t this speak of double standards and a serious case of Islamophobia?

    This is no Islamophobia. This is simply a dispassionate appraisal of available facts. Muslims are quite capable of living in peace with non-Muslims where they are in small minority.

    If you are an Indian, live in India, swear by India.. but Oh!.. you left your great country for another…

    Yes. I believe in secularism and democracy anywhere in the world. OTOH, Muslims want secularism and democracy ONLY where they are in minority. They want equal citizenship rights for themselves in non-Muslim majority countries. In return they are ready to grant a dhimmi status to non-Muslims in Muslim majority countries. I do not understand why Muslims cannot see any double standards here.
    Again, you would like me to believe that it is just my islamophobia, but I would request you to counter my argument with a contrary example.

  19. None of us – Abhilash, me or anyone else justified the torture or killing of Kashmiris. What I am saying is that it is an unfortunate result of the separatist movement led by Kashmiris. If the movement ends today, the difficulties will end today. Look at the movie hall picture on your site (Sakooter). Who changed that picture? Is army there because of the separatism or is separatism because of the army? All over the world, it is the same chicken-and egg-question.

  20. I wanted to laugh aloud when you said..
    “Now, you show me one place where Muslims are living in peace with non-Muslims?”

    Go back and read history.
    The places where Muslims are in conflict with the other communities have reasons which any thinking human being would consider very justified. The problem is that the likes of you ‘unfortunately’ would put the blame on Muslim.
    You have read what I had to say, and yet you clearly close your eyes. You obviously have nothing to say regarding the injustice that the Muslims have suffered. You would simply brush it aside because ‘they are Muslims’.

    And just another point I’d like to think about.. the position of “dhimmis” in an Islamic state. Do you have ANY idea what Islam says about treatment of the non-muslims in Islamic state.
    Treat them with justice.
    Settle their disputes according to their religious scriptures.
    Provide protection to them.

    I’d post a letter which Abu Bakr wrote on my blog soon.. It would do you good to read through that.

    Anyways… there is no point continuing the discussion,

    dapaan kokaras che’ kuni zang…

  21. Sakooter said:

    Go back and read history.The places where Muslims are in conflict with the other communities have reasons which any thinking human being would consider very justified.

    Fair enough.
    However, if you consider that the ideology which sees the world divided in two parts as “darul-harb” and “darul-islam” and all human beings in “kaafirs” and “momins” has no part to play in it, think again. Hate only fuels hate.

    And just another point I’d like to think about.. the position of “dhimmis” in an Islamic state. Do you have ANY idea what Islam says about treatment of the non-muslims in Islamic state.Treat them with justice.Settle their disputes according to their religious scriptures.Provide protection to them.

    Yes. I understand the status of “dhimmi” in a Islamic state. In medieval times he was better off than a non-Christian in a Christian state. It does not however mean that he was treated as equal. He was not allowed to bear arms or bear witness against muslims in a court of law and his life was less valuable.
    In all schools of Islamic jurisprudence, except the Hanafi, the maximum punishment for the murder of a dhimmi, if perpetrated by a Muslim, was the payment of blood money; no death penalty was possible. For Maliki and Hanbali schools of jurisprudence, the value of a dhimmi’s life was one-half the value of a Muslim’s life; in the Shafi’i school, Jews and Christians were worth one-third of a Muslim and Zoroastrians were worth just one-fifteenth.
    I can go on and on but I am not really bothered about what happened in some distant past. I am more concerned about what happens now. Today I can show you a dozen examples from Muslim majority countries where Hindu cannot build a temple. Some Muslim majority countries do not even allow cremation on their soil for non-Muslims. OTOH I do not know of any non-Muslim countries that practice such legal barbarism even where they are theocratic states. If such is your idea of fairness, I am better off being treated unfairly.

  22. Abhilash

    It was totally obvious from your responses that your totally unaware of the Kashmir history, if you weren’t, you wouldn’t have claimed a lot of things which you have.

    I fully agree with the above. People’s aspirations must come supreme in any civilized society. However it will be wrong to pretend that at its root Kashmir issue is anything else but a religious one.

    And till 1980’s Kashmiris were not as staunch Muslims as they, all of a sudden, became in 1989? Did you know that Operation Gibraltar of Pakistan failed because Kashmiris did not cooperate with the Pakistani army captains who had reached as far as Srinagar? But you do not. Did you know that the Islamic zealots fighting the Indian government today fought the 1987 elections and lost because the elections were rigged? But you do not. Did you know that one of the most credible and elected by the people leader of Kashmir, Sheikh Abdullah, was under arrest for more than 22 years in Indian jails? Do you know why? Because he spoke for Kashmiris! You do not see the injustices meted out to Kashmiris right from 1947. The gradual destruction of the autonomy, arresting of elected leaders, transferring those Governors  who wouldn’t listen to 7 Race Course Road to godforsaken places. The only thing you see is the Muslims of Kashmir. Nothing more than that. If you tried maybe you would see some of the facts of Kashmir but you do not want to, because that may prove a big blow to your ideology of Muslims being the only axis of evil. Did you read this post or did you just miss out reading Noam Chomsky’s words, “The Hindu nationalist danger is certainly serious,” or for that matter Professor William Bakers’, “People who live in the valley of Kashmir are not Islamic radicals out to establish a separate Islamic state. You haven’t said much about the innocents being killed by the Indian Army? Or is not saying anything a subtle approval of their acts?

    The real issue is that the ideology of “kill the infidels, wherever ye find them”

    And yet in Kashmir, it is the innocents who fall prey to the army bullets. Maybe they are taught “kill the Muslims, whenever ye see them”
    Did you know that the term Islamic Rage Boy term is copyrighted and IRB products are specifically sold by Cafe Press, who also sell this!
    And a few words from the PM of your country of birth:

    The PM cautioned against fixing labels like Muslims and non-Muslims or labelling, for that matter, any community or country as terrorists as that would trigger “a new set of grievances.” “Terrorists belong to no religion of community,” he said. “If some Indians are terrorists that does not mean all Indians are terrorists. So let’s not target communities.” The PM added: “As a Sikh, I understand the trauma (of being labelled).” Source

  23. Raman

    Why don’t we (Hindus) and Sikhs, or people of other regions of the state feel subjugated by India — that too when it has been the Muslims of Kashmir who ruled after 1947? Those rulers may have been “puppets” of Delhi, but they were not representatives of the minorities any more than that.

    You chose to create Indian, we did not. You became independent in 1947 from the British, we were occupied by you, that’s why. Accession is a facade, even if the Maharaja did sign the papers on his own free will, a autocratic Maharaja had no right to chose our fate. Wasn’t Indian helping Sheikh Abdullah to fight the same Maharaja whom they later forced not to declare independence? Hypocrisy of India is obvious since 1947.

    Sakooter has conveniently forgotten about Chittisinghpora massacre and does not want to talk about massacres of other minorities. I don’t want to talk about that either, because that causes another burst of anti-India rhetoric on this blog.
    ~K~, Nanak Singh Bedi’s statement does not prove anything. All he says is that the killers were masked, which is nothing unusual. But, saying that Indian government did it is like saying US attacked the WTC and Pentagon itself. That is a nice way to diverting the blame.

    First you refer to Chittisinghpora because you want the readers to believe that the militants killed them, then you say Nanak Singh’s statement proves nothing. Agreed. So, what proves the militants did it? Are they so dumb headed that the day Bill Clinton visits they kill innocents to send the message that they are barbaric and intolerant beasts? Helps their cause a lot, doesn’t it?  Though if you had read Nanak Singh’s statement you would realise that he said the militants never harmed them in 10 years! That says something. Doesn’t it?Let’s not talk about statements. Let’s see what happened later on. Seven innocents were killed and branded as the perpetuators of the  Chittisinghpora massacre. The same day seven local innocents went missing and then the rest is history. The fake encounter was proved beyond doubt.Says quiet something about the Indian government and the army and that’s why living here makes a difference, one knows what’s happening? 

  24. K said:

    And till 1980’s Kashmiris were not as staunch Muslims as they, all of a sudden, became in 1989? Did you know that Operation Gibraltar of Pakistan failed because Kashmiris did not cooperate with the Pakistani army captains who had reached as far as Srinagar? But you do not. Did you know that the Islamic zealots fighting the Indian government today fought the 1987 elections and lost because the elections were rigged? But you do not. Did you know that one of the most credible and elected by the people leader of Kashmir, Sheikh Abdullah, was under arrest for more than 22 years in Indian jails? Do you know why? Because he spoke for Kashmiris! You do not see the injustices meted out to Kashmiris right from 1947. The gradual destruction of the autonomy, arresting of elected leaders, transferring those Governors who wouldn’t listen to 7 Race Course Road to godforsaken places. The only thing you see is the Muslims of Kashmir.

    K

    I fully support Kashmiri people’s right to self determination. However, it does not mean that I can ignore the fact that religious intolerance is at the core of this conflict. If injustices alone were the cause of separation then half the states of India would have separated by now. So what makes Kashmir different?

    The difference is in the ideology of majority. There is ample empirical evidence available from the world over that Muslims when in majority do not want to live with non-Muslims. I do not see how you can falsify it.

    Did you read this post or did you just miss out reading Noam Chomsky’s words, “The Hindu nationalist danger is certainly serious,”

    I am in total agreement with Noam Chomsky. Hindu fascism is on the rise in India and I find it equally reprehensible. However, in different parts of the world I see hindus living quite peacefully with non-Hindus — something I cannot say about Muslims.

    or for that matter Professor William Bakers’, “People who live in the valley of Kashmir are not Islamic radicals out to establish a separate Islamic state.”

    First, this guy is a sham professor. Check his credentials. He ain’t a professor nowhere.

    Secondly, he is unaware of the nature of Islamic polity. There is no moderate Islamic state. Even when it starts as a moderate state it ends up as a mulla raj. Didn’t Pakistan started as a ’secular’ nation?

    You haven’t said much about the innocents being killed by the Indian Army? Or is not saying anything a subtle approval of their acts?

    I said I unreservedly condemn killing of innocents and esp. so when it is done by law enforcing agencies. You think it is an approval?

    And a few words from the PM of your country of birth:…

    What he says is correct. Neither all Muslims are terrorists nor all non-Muslims are Gandhi.

    What he did not say is also correct. An overwhelming majority of today’s terrorists is Muslim.

  25. “An overwhelming majority of today’s terrorists is Muslim” – Abhilash you say it so easily.

    This is the height of blindness!

    I had asked earlier and I ask again,
    Don’t you think Palestinians saying don’t occupy my territory and call it yours are doing something right?
    Don’t you think the Bosnians who fought against the Serbs who butchered and raped them did something right?
    Don’t you think the Chechnyans who rose against communist Yeltsin who massacred them did something right?
    Don’t you think the Afghans who first fought the Russians and then the Americans did something right?

    Your problem is simple. You FAIL to see the reasons that these people are fighting, simply because they happen to be Muslims. Its so convenient for you to label a muslim as terrorist, coz it makes so easy for you to continue believing that all the rogue nations are doing nothing but helping humanity get rid of trash.

    Shameful! Shameful indeed are the doublestandards which
    – would not call the Israelis terrorist, but blame the Muslims.
    – would not say a word against the Serbs who proved to be butchers, but blame the Muslims
    – would not call Americans occupiers – who went and attacked Afghanistan on pretext of proofs which they couldnt share with the world, but blame the Muslims
    – would not see that Babri Masjid was destroyed, muslims were burnt in Gujrat, but continue blaming the Muslims

    Overwhelming majority of Muslims is terrorist? Convenient very convenient. Label them all in one go, without looking at why they are making so much noise…

    Truth is bitter. If were to taste the truth you’d see the torture your “mahaan bharat” takes pride in.. you’d probably hate calling yourself Indian. If you could see through the double-standard your great United States maintains, you wouldnt want to live in a terrorist state!

  26. Something I think you should read. Maybe you then wont say, “overwhelming majority of today’s terrorists are Muslim”…

    —————————————————-
    1) Which is the only country in the world to have dropped bombs on over twenty different countries since 1945?

    2) Which is the only country to have used nuclear weapons?

    3) Which country was responsible for a car bomb which killed 80 civilians in Beirut in 1985, in a botched assassination attempt, thereby making it the most lethal terrorist bombing in modern Middle East history?

    4) Which country’s illegal bombing of Libya in 1986 was described by the UN Legal Committee as a “classic case” of terrorism?

    5) Which country rejected the order of the International Court of Justice (ICJ) to terminate its “unlawful use of force” against Nicaragua in 1986, and then vetoed a UN Security Council resolution calling on all states to observe international law?

    6) Which country was accused by a UN-sponsored truth commission of providing “direct and indirect support” for “acts of genocide” against the Mayan Indians in Guatemala during the 1980s?

    7) Which country unilaterally withdrew from the Anti-Ballistic Missile (ABM) Treaty in December 2001?

    8) Which country renounced the efforts to negotiate a verification process for the Biological Weapons Convention and brought an international conference on the matter to a halt in July 2001?

    9) Which country prevented the United Nations from curbing the gun trade at a small arms conference in July 2001?

    10) Aside from Somalia , which is the only other country in the world to have refused to ratify the UN Convention on the Rights of the Child?

    11) Which is the only Western country which allows the death penalty to be applied to children?

    12) Which is the only G7 country to have refused to sign the 1997 Mine Ban Treaty, forbidding the use of landmines?

    13) Which is the only G7 country to have voted against the creation of the International Criminal Court (ICC) in 1998?

    14) Which was the only other country to join with Israel in opposing a 1987 General Assembly resolution condemning international terrorism?

    15) Which country refuses to fully pay its debts to the United Nations yet reserves its right to veto United Nations resolutions?

    Answer to all 15 questions:

    The United States of America

  27. Sakooter:

    I do not live in a simplified version of reality with neat categories of “oppressor” and “oppressed” and I refuse to side with violence whatever side it might be coming from.

    When I see a Babri mosque or a Gujarat carnage, I do not rationalize them on the basis of some historical wrongs committed against hindus. Rather I hang my head in shame. Show me one place where I have rationalized violence by anyone. OTOH, it is you who are justifying violence coming from a particular side. I am looking all violence as violence.

    I did not devise the lens that sees the world divided into “kaafirs” and “muslims”. You did. Then why are you surprised if the rest of the world also starts seeing muslims through the same “us-versus-them” lens?

    You justify killing of someone for the fault of slander and then wonder why the rest of the world refuses to share your violent world view. Things will become much simpler if only you looked at all violence as violence and all human beings as humans – not just kaafirs vs. muslims.

  28. I think it is wrong to deny the people of Jammu-Kashmir the right to a national independent state by trying to turn it into a religious struggle. The Mayflower brigade still try to cling to the ‘one nation in divisible under God’ and the Jewish state is not criticized for its majority Jewish population.

  29. It is very simple, if the problem is between Indian part and Pakistan part of Kashmir… let entire India and Pakistan including Kashmiris of both side vote and let majority decide whether PoK should be handed over to India or not.. that is the only problem which needs to be solved… as far as people cribbing about violence in Kashmir, as rightly pointed out, except truth and fact… STOP terrorism…automatically military presence will go.

    But then there are people who want to kill their brothers and sisters, others cannot help. Kashmir is and will always remain part of Atoot India. Ameen

  30. The worst face of oppression which the Kashmiris (Kashur) have been enduring since several decades resulting from arrogance of Indian fanatic extremists and their full political support from the administrative powers coupled with double-standard nature of Indian media (appropriately termed as ‘blindia’) is clear to everyone. I wouldn’t like to hide this fact that the culprit face of external forces is not also now hidden to the Kashur youth. It is an obvious fact that everyone outsider is well versed about the situation of this place which is some times considered to be the auspicious place in Kalash (Kasmira), sometimes considered to be the auspicious land of meadows and springs where the lost ten tribes of Bani Israel find their shelter and some times regarded as the ultimate worldly destination of Youz Asaf. Further though every one finds in him/her sympathy for poor Kashur but for what fun. O outsiders please don’t mind this is nothing but your pseudo-sympathy for us (Kashmiris). Actually from every cry, pain, agony and despondency of our’s you get a repository amount of literature and now static or moving pictures to be communicated for advertisement. Believe me this all is done to fulfill the materialistic purposes of international powers and nothing else. We hate your worthless support because it is only to make comments for political purpose. Do you believe that your deceptive approach could succeed in relieving our pain. No…not at all…because now every blooming bud of Kashir now keeps in his/her remembrances a repository of live scenes of Indian made atrocities and terror on innocent Kashmiris. Every youth hold in their heart the unhealed wounds given by the silent tears of our women which either turned into widow without fault or lost their intimate ones mercilessly…

  31. ENOUGH IS ENOUGH , It`s very unfortunate that kashmiri are crying & blaming India , actually those people are encouraged by cheap politicians, more than muslims from pakistan are happily living in India , bollywood actors– salman khan , shahrukh khan , cricketers–zaheer khan & Md azharuddin , president– APJ abdul kalam , Writer- Javed Akthar , but give one hindu name from pakistan. Muslims of Mumbai wants to hang Kasab . Kashmiri should decide are they Indians or pakistanis , because kashmir belongs to India .

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